A couple of years ago I spent a season visiting with a counselor in the Twin Cities.
I think it was in the third session where my counselor told me that he was going to Florida for a few weeks and would be unavailable to meet during that time. He gave me his cell phone number should I need to call.
I said to him:
“Oh, I don’t want to bother you when you’re on vacation.”
His answer back to me is something I haven’t forgotten:
“I won’t let you bother me.”
Seeing the confused look on my face, he explained a little more:
“You are welcome to call me, Jeremy, but if I am unable or don’t want to talk, then I won’t answer the phone. You can leave a message and I’ll get back to you when I am able or want to. But I won’t let you bother me.”
I don’t like bothering people, so I often won’t assert myself with another person about something I might need because I don’t want to trouble them about it. I try to prevent burdening anyone with what I need until it is convenient for them.
I had never considered this personal stance until that day. I had never thought about letting other people make those decisions for themselves instead of anticipating that I was a burden or a bother. Additionally, I had often been a willing victim of other peoples intrusions into my life instead of taking a stance against it.
What my counselor taught me that day was asserting myself in both directions.
Making a personal decision to do or not do something based on what I need in the moment, rather than being a victim of other people’s needs in any given moment. If I got a phone call, and I’m at home with my family, it is my decision whether to answer it or not based on what my family needs at the moment.
Refraining from holding back on making pre-emptive decisions for people based on not wanting to bother them. I needed to let people make their own assertions whether or not to take my call or have a conversation.
I learned that I needed to change how I functioned both for myself as well as for other people.
My counselor’s statement asserted his position: He said I could call him if I needed to. That was my decision whether or not I needed to. It was his decision when to answer.
My seasoned, wise counselor schooled me on how to function better and make decisions for myself as well as refraining from making other people’s decisions for them.
A few things have happened since I stepped away from full-time ministry at Hayward Wesleyan Church:
HACIL
On July 1, I started working for HACIL, a virtual charter school in the Hayward Community School District. I was hired to work with high school students and their families in the area of social studies as well as teach some enrichment classes on-site on Tuesdays and Thursdays. I get to teach Civics with high school students and a STEM class with 5th and 6th graders. Also, on October 1, I got to add technology support to the job at HACIL as well, which brings me to full-time there.
Working at HACIL has been fun and refreshing. I get to work among a group of experienced professionals who are all concentrated in the area of educating and engaging with young people, which means I get to continue to teach and have fun with students (two of my favorite things)!
Real Estate
Additionally, in August, I started studying for the WI Real Estate exam. I got licensed as a real estate licensee at the end of September and have joined Woodland Developments & Realty as a sales associate. I’m excited to join my wife, Amanda, as well as Gary and the rest of the Woodland team in a real estate adventure.
Post Ministry Reflections
It has been interesting to step out of full-time ministry and work in the marketplace (as compared with being a pastor). I’ve had numerous people ask me how we are doing. My stock answer is that we are doing well. If people have more time, or really want to know we share a little more:
What’s been interesting and different is when I was a pastor I was paid a salary. I know that’s obvious, but whenever the issue of a pastor’s pay came up in conversations with folks over the years, I typically shared that a pastor is the epitome of a salary-paid position, in which I meant that I was paid not for the hours I put in, but for who I was as a person. I wasn’t paid to be full-time, but all-time. I wasn’t “on the clock” for a full-time set of hours… you know… the typical 45-60 hours of work in a week with time off in the evenings or weekends. For sure I had time off, but I never stopped “being” a pastor when I was off. It was easier when I was at home. But a trip to Walmart or Marketplace or anywhere else out of my house? Don’t get me wrong, this wasn’t negative. I loved it. I didn’t mind it. I signed up for it and I leaned into it. I loved being an all-time pastor. I loved being available and present for people. In fact, I don’t think it’s right for a pastor to be anything less.
Pastors get paid a full-time salary so they don’t have to worry about money. Their needs are met. They don’t have to do any additional income-generating activity, so the intention goes, in order to be able to focus on ministering to people. What a blessing it was to be able to be paid in such a way that I was able to be available and present for people over the years.
What has been interesting and different is now that I’m not a pastor, I don’t get paid that salary to be available and present for people in the same way. Now Jeremy Mavis hasn’t changed as a person, but my availability to love and serve people in the same way has changed. Now my availability is taken up by billable hours. Because I get paid by the hour now, I have to work and focus on my job in order to make money to provide for my family. When I was a pastor, focusing and being available for people was my job and the way I provided for my family.
This hasn’t been a subtle change for me. It’s difficult for me to flip the switch and focus on my job and not necessarily being available and present for people. It’s disequilibrating for me. It throws me off balance. I hadn’t expected this. I have to adjust my expectations of both what I want to be available to do as well as what I can actually do.
It’s been a fascinating transition to post-pastoral life.
For now, I’m focused on a few things:
My family. My family has gotten the immediate benefits of this transition. They got the mental space and physical presence and availability of their husband and father back.
Teaching Civics and STEM, interacting with families and students regarding social studies as well as tech support at HACIL.
Real estate. I’m pretty excited about joining Amanda’s world in real estate. She is so good and experienced in the practice of real estate transactions (both on the buying and selling side). We’ve been intrigued at the idea of working in a profession together. We kinda like each other, so we’re looking forward to working hand-in-hand with one another in taking care of people both listing a home and buying property. Should be fun!
Yesterday, Pastor Chad shared some more details about my impending departure at all three services at Hayward Wesleyan Church as well as how things are looking for the new positions. Sunday, June 9 will be my last day on staff, and I get the honor of preaching that morning.
This definitely hasn’t been a secret. I announced that I would be stepping away from full-time ministry at HWC back in November. Every single week (and throughout the week) we get asked this question and yesterday Amanda and I got it a lot!
“So, have you figured out what’s next yet?”
The short answer?
Nope.
The long answer?
Hayward, WI has been our established home for almost 16 years. I was single when I came to Hayward and got a position on staff, got married within the first year, bought a house a year later, and had our first child two years later and then another child almost two years later as well. Hayward has been the place where Amanda and I have started and grown our family. Contrast that with my life growing up in a military family where we moved constantly, our two girls have only known one town, one house, one backyard, one set of schools, one faith community, and many friends in this one place. We are settled in this community, in so many ways.
The thought of leaving Hayward for another community is difficult for Amanda and I (and the girls). It is not a switch that can easily be flipped; nor should it be. We didn’t hold back… we still haven’t held back. We have poured our hearts and lives into participating with the Spirit of God in seeing students and families reconciled to God and flourishing in his kingdom. Sixteen years worth of relational engagement has an embedding quality to it.
This is what has been interesting for us these last six months as we have processed and continue to process what is next for our family.
We don’t know yet.
We have held back from making any further decisions about life or location changes until after June 9th. We want to be fully present here and at Hayward Wesleyan until then.
Sure we have been thinking, wondering, imagining, and looking. We check The Wesleyan Church jobs postings every other week or so. We have scrolled through ChurchStaffing.com under Youth Pastors and other positions regularly, and have been reached out to by a handful of churches that are looking for a pastor. To be honest, while a few have peaked our interest, not once has any led us to make any moves toward further inquiry.
Both Amanda and I know without a doubt that it is the right thing for us to step away from Hayward Wesleyan Church right now. We knew it back in November and we still believe it today. There was nothing wrong, and there is nothing wrong. We just both feel that our season of time as the youth and children and family pastor in Hayward through Hayward Wesleyan Church has come to an end, and a new season both for the Mavis family as well as the HWC family is upon us.
“So, what is your plan, Jeremy? What is happening Monday, June 10th?”
In a time of uncertainty, I believe the best thing one can do is take the next right step. It doesn’t have to be the “big” next step, but just the next “right” one, no matter how big or simple. And it has to be a step. It can’t be wallowing in self-pity.
Here is Jeremy, Amanda, Sari and Macie’s next right step:
Amanda is going to work where she has worked for the past 16 years. Jeremy, Sari and Macie are going to spend the morning doing chores and “blessing the house” as Amanda calls it, and probably swimming in the pool in the afternoon or some other weather appropriate activity, then relax and reflect in the evening together as the first day of a monumental life change settles in around us.
And then we will do something similar the next day… and the next day after that…
I will be spending the summer with our girls and completing some stalled projects on our house as well as other personal business entities. We have saved prudently these six months knowing that this transition would shake our family finances a bit, so it looks like I will only have to engage in a few side projects where I can make money to contribute to our family income this summer.
The girls and I will be swimming, biking, camping, adventuring, and making some memories together! Amanda will join us at various times as we make sure when she comes home from work that she can relax and enjoy downtime with us.
That our family’s next right step.
Anything beyond this is conjecture.
It seems like we might be in Hayward for longer than the summer, though. We are not in a hurry to jump into another ministry job somewhere. A friend of mine used the analogy of a football game and the tradition of a halftime break in between the two halves of the game. He dubbed this next right step as a sort of halftime–a break between the two halves. I liked that idea.
My family, after 16 years of immersed ministry and deep relational engagement in our beloved community, needs a halftime. They need their husband and their dad’s full attention for a season.
And they are going to get it!
We are not sure how long this “halftime” will last. Could be six months, or a year, or eight years. We are just really not sure. The idea of staying in Hayward longer, even though I won’t be an employed pastor at Hayward Wesleyan, makes us smile.
If this “halftime” lasts longer than the summer, which it currently looks like it will, I will have to find a job in the Fall. We won’t be able to survive financially, if I continue to just stay at home. And that wouldn’t be a next “right” step. Which means I get to love people and exemplify the kingdom of God in some profession outside of that of an ordained clergy. That makes me smile as well.
The LORD is in this… we know this to be true. He is orchestrating this both for our family as well as the HWC family. It is in his hands that we trust and hope and rely… even when we don’t.
It’s funny, when people have asked how Amanda and I are doing in this season of transition, I have shared that in our better moments we are fully trusting the LORD, and in worse moments we are freaking out! Thankfully, so far at least, we are not on the same cycle. When I’m freaking out, Amanda is trusting. When I might be trusting, Amanda is freaking out. This is faith working itself out in real-life, which is where we all are on a regular basis. We just need to be honest about it!
Thank you for caring about us, loving us, and worrying (in a good way) about us.
Yesterday was the last Followers at Hayward Wesleyan Church of the school year and my last Followers.
What a fun afternoon!
We put our hand-prints on the wall, ate amazing food, played games, laughed, celebrated, and just had a good time.
It was bittersweet.
Sweet because I’m happy at what Followers has done in the lives and hearts of students over the years
Bitter because I’m sad to be stepping away from spiritual and relational leadership with the students
I have LOVED both teaching and modeling the love of Jesus and communicating the heart of the Father with hundreds of students over the last 16 years. I constantly hear from former students (some who are still involved in the church and even those who aren’t) how impactful Followers was when they were kids in elementary school. I also hear from parents how appreciative they are for Followers and its influence on their kids’ lives.
I am so thankful to have been a part of this incredible ministry for my time at Hayward Wesleyan.
Followers has indeed left its mark on the lives of many!
For 21 weeks in 2019, the students and teachers in Main Street at Hayward Wesleyan Church are interacting with the curriculum from Saturate the World called The Story of God for Kids.
11) Story: Passover
This is the eleventh story in the curriculum found in Exodus 5-15.
For 21 weeks in 2019, the students and teachers in Main Street at Hayward Wesleyan Church are interacting with the curriculum from Saturate the World called The Story of God for Kids.
10) Story: Moses
This is the tenth story in the curriculum found in Exodus 1-4.
For 21 weeks in 2019, the students and teachers in Main Street at Hayward Wesleyan Church are interacting with the curriculum from Saturate the World called The Story of God for Kids.
9) Story: Joseph
This is the ninth story in the curriculum found in Genesis 37-39, 41-50.
For 21 weeks in 2019, the students and teachers in Main Street at Hayward Wesleyan Church are interacting with the curriculum from Saturate the World called The Story of God for Kids.
8) Story: Jacob and Esau
This is the eighth story in the curriculum found in Genesis 25, 27.
For 21 weeks in 2019, the students and teachers in Main Street at Hayward Wesleyan Church are interacting with the curriculum from Saturate the World called The Story of God for Kids.
7) Story: Isaac
This is the seventh story in the curriculum found in Genesis 22.
For 21 weeks in 2019, the students and teachers in Main Street at Hayward Wesleyan Church are interacting with the curriculum from Saturate the World called The Story of God for Kids.
6) Story: Covenant
This is the sixth story in the curriculum found in Genesis 11-18, 21.
For 21 weeks in 2019, the students and teachers in Main Street at Hayward Wesleyan Church are interacting with the curriculum from Saturate the World called The Story of God for Kids.
5) Story: The Flood
This is the fifth story in the curriculum, found in Genesis 4-9.
For 21 weeks in 2019, the students and teachers in Main Street at Hayward Wesleyan Church are interacting with the curriculum from Saturate the World called The Story of God for Kids.
4) Story: Cain and Abel
This is the fourth story in the curriculum, found in Genesis 4.
